Old Overholt 114 proof and Peterson's Hyde Park!

SPEAKER_00 0:09

Welcome to the Whiskey Chasers, where we talk about our passion for whiskey and its history, either amongst ourselves or while interviewing distilleries. Oh, while enjoying a glass. I'm Steve. I'm Nick, and I'm Chris. Please enjoy responsibly while enjoying this week's episode of The Whiskey Chasers.

SPEAKER_01 0:28

So the 114 is pretty common now. Old overhaul. Now it is. Now. At one point it was just Pennsylvania in Ohio. No, it was just Pennsylvania. Then it became Pennsylvania, Ohio. And then it became rare. Like maybe we won't do it all the time. Now it's it's common in Pennsylvania and Ohio. I don't know outside of that. I I don't know that I've seen it. I haven't looked, but this is at least available.

SPEAKER_00 0:56

How available was it about three years ago? Not not? Okay.

SPEAKER_01 1:01

Three years ago, Chris and I that's when it was limited, right? Three years ago was about for the 114. No. Was it only three years ago when that came out? So the club is five. So the club is on year five. So two years ago. Right. So two, three years ago, it wasn't it wasn't that available as limited at that time.

SPEAKER_04 1:21

Oh, I see what you mean. Because it came out and then it didn't, then it was yeah, yes. And then it came back, yeah. I I see what you're saying.

SPEAKER_01 1:28

So at the time it was limited, they were they did not know how much they would make, how they they really kind of entered into it with like dipping their toes because they were kind of afraid.

SPEAKER_04 1:38

I think they were kind of afraid it wasn't gonna do well.

SPEAKER_01 1:40

They did the same with the Malagahala 10 and 11. In fact, the 10 year they said limited, we won't do anymore. And then the next year, no, two years? Maybe two years after that, they did 11. So that they have a history of like, I don't know if this will do well. Yeah, like it's um how do I put this? I feel like Beam has a history of like, I don't know, we'll say it's limited, and then possibly let's put out some more. They've had a few bottles or a few lineups that they are dead set on. This is not coming out again. Little book not coming out again. They've been very like dead set. This is not doing no, we're not doing this. Jim Beam did a was it a fall or winter release? It was a toasted barrel of their normal Jim Beam. I that that was last year, maybe two years ago, year and a half, somewhere in there. I don't know if they'll release that again. They did a Jim Beam single barrel. That is said to be done done. Like guys are going crazy trying to get those those up again. Jim Beam double oaked, I think, is done. The Jim Beam double and Jim Beam Black. Wait, black is done. They're done making it Jim Beam Black. Double oaked might be still there, but black and black black.

SPEAKER_04 3:06

I thought they were gonna keep making black.

SPEAKER_01 3:07

One of the two, they still so they brought up black is just their extra age. They brought up black and double oaked around the same time and devil's cut. Devil's cut is done. Black and double oaked.

SPEAKER_04 3:18

So wait, when did any of this happen? No, maybe not. It's on the shelves today. Well, then, but but they might be done making it.

SPEAKER_01 3:25

Devil's, black, and double. One of those three they stopped.

SPEAKER_04 3:29

Well, I need to figure that out.

SPEAKER_01 3:31

Yeah, because I want to go out and buy them.

SPEAKER_02 3:32

I do like all of those.

SPEAKER_00 3:33

I like all the things. Maybe it's double.

SPEAKER_04 3:35

I actually like devil's cut more than I originally did.

SPEAKER_00 3:37

I really like double's cut too. If it's that, I want to buy a kit. It was more of all that they stopped.

SPEAKER_04 3:42

Great price. I mean, I I if they were getting rid of any of those, I would go out and buy it. Well, they stopped with the Jim Beam single, single barrel. They stopped that. Yeah, I was never huge. That was a little overpriced in here.

SPEAKER_01 3:52

You didn't like that. It was good. It was 1920 bucks outside of Ohio.

SPEAKER_04 3:56

The single barrel? Yep. In Ohio, it was like 40 bucks or something. At the time, everything else for 20, you know. You can get it cheaper in Kentucky, yeah. Steve, you want this? We're we're gonna smoke Hyde Park. Oh, good. We're gonna smoke something. I'm gonna smoke something. Uh, we're smoking Hyde Park today.

SPEAKER_01 4:13

And this is not the steakhouse that we talked about.

SPEAKER_04 4:16

No, this is Peterson, formerly Dunhill.

SPEAKER_01 4:19

Okay, so you say formerly Dunhill, uh, Cornell and Deal is the sorry. Okay, maybe it's Cornell and Deal and Dunhill that I get confused. Confused. Did I say that?

SPEAKER_04 4:29

Dunhill is a blank, it's a brand, a brand that uh stopped. Stopped. Um, and actually that was uh right around the time McClellan stopped.

SPEAKER_01 4:39

And it was kind of dealing with a frog and a log.

SPEAKER_04 4:41

No, that's that's that's McClellan. Uh crap. Dunhill does nightcap, Elizabethan, early morning pipe, Hyde Park, Dun Dunhill Flake. You see that sitting there? That actually says Dunhill. They have been making blends for a long time. I mean 70s, 70s, 80s, so long, long time. And they were a tobacco company, they made cigarettes as well, like high-end stuff. They went into accessories, they started making lighters and and their pipes, their pipes are thousands of dollars, but anyway, five thousand dollars. Yeah, oh yeah, they're crazy expensive. But for whatever reason, they went into like, let's make leather jackets and purses and wallets. What? And they just kind of went like high-end with that stuff, and I guess they sold because they moved more and more into that, and less and less, and then at some point back in the god, I don't know when it was 2018, something like that. They were like, you know, we really don't want to be associated with tobacco anymore, which is funny because they are literally a tobacco company. Like they sell out, they didn't want to be associated with tobacco anymore. They were like, this doesn't meet our, you know, standards of who we are. And I'm like, Well, who are you? Because that's what you are. That's who you are. Somebody either inherited it or or bought it and then just decided no more. So they they they're done, they sold out. And um, there was a freak out. I mean, I did a I I pulled a freak out, but uh that time I I actually bought a bunch, like not with McClellan. I kind of like because I think Dunhill happened before McClellan, because I I freaked out and bought a crap load of Dunhill stuff, and then when McClellan was gonna air quotes close its doors, I was like, yeah, right. So I didn't buy it, and I was like, I'm screwed. Because what happened with Dunhill is they got they done they were done. But before even product ran out, STG, Scandinavian Tobacco Company, uh, basically the people that make uh lane one uh Captain Black and all that stuff, they were like, We're picking it up, we're picking it up, and matter of fact, we've been making it for years, so nothing's changing but the name. So Peterson uh kind of acquired the rights to it, and uh it's being made by STG, which it was always being made by STG. So literally, like when I I would I would try like side-by-side tens, it's like this is the same stuff with a different name, it just says Peterson now instead of Dunhill. So nothing changed. McClellan, when they closed, they closed, and that was something different. But now everything's Peterson, so Peterson Hyde Park, but Hyde Park's been around for a long time. On the back, if you read it, it says it's a traditional English blint blend, which is funny because it's not an English tobacco at all, it's just Virginia's, and there's like no Latikia.

SPEAKER_00 7:26

It's like Virginia's and uh Dark Fire, Dark Fire Virginia, yeah, sun-grilled, cured Indian and burly tobaccos.

SPEAKER_04 7:36

Yeah, and if you smell it, I mean it does not even smell smoky. It's not a it's a fantastic blend, though. This is a meat and potatoes blend. Okay, this goes great after a steak.

SPEAKER_00 7:46

I was doing some research on this double oaked, black, all this kind of stuff. All of those things are still being made. Black, double oak, uh uh, and and uh and uh uh devil's gut, all three of those. Really? But black did make a change in 2024. They just they just made it, they added the seven-year age statement back onto it.

SPEAKER_01 8:08

So they added a that's why the black seven-year came out, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 8:12

So the black is the same thing, but they they just they just add the age statement, so it's still it's still gonna be still a little bit more than what you but not much for a seven year.

SPEAKER_04 8:24

I mean, it's it's literally double the age everything else is, so more than double, really, because they're all like three years.

SPEAKER_01 8:30

It was the uh Jim Beam winter blend was toasted. What's the double black? Double black is double black is extra aged.

SPEAKER_04 8:37

Okay, so what's double double oaked is pretty much toasted, right? Yeah, there is no double black actually. It's it's gym beam black, which is double, which is which is extra aged. It even says it says black extra aged. Then you have Jim Beam double oaked, which is the blue label. But not toast just it's it's it's it's double oaked, you know what I mean? It's it's it's three years or whatever, but it's double oaked.

SPEAKER_01 8:57

Okay, so double oaked so Woodford double oaked, it's toasted. So it's the the the second oak is a toasted barrel.

SPEAKER_04 9:06

I don't think that they're getting that fancy with that.

SPEAKER_01 9:08

I literally think that's you got Jim Beam winter blend is the toasted thing.

SPEAKER_04 9:11

They say you toasted it. Yeah, I think with the Jim Beam, what they do is they're they're dunking it in a new charred oaked barrel for like maybe maybe like a year and a half or two years or whatever. Then they're dumping in another new charred oak barrel, which is giving double the amount of oak. And you can taste it on there. I mean, it is definitely more oaky, yeah. It's it's more, and then you've got the bonded gym beam bonnet, which is the gold label, and you've got a green rye, which I don't think I've ever had. And then there's something else. Devil's devil's cut, they did white white label, single barrel, I guess. The winter label now, or the but even the single barrel is in a different bottle. Like as far as that lineup goes with the same bottles, you got white, green, blue, red, technically, which is the stag, but that's not like a foolproof.

SPEAKER_01 10:04

Oh, the the stag used to be.

SPEAKER_04 10:05

Those are all in the same bottle. The single barrel's in kind of a different bottle.

SPEAKER_01 10:09

Uh, they changed that.

SPEAKER_04 10:10

It's it's it's the same standard now because it was like in a with a small top and a it was kind of body, but yeah, it's more of a squared off bottle. So I remember when that came out, I was like, that's kind of cool, but it's a little expensive for what it is.

SPEAKER_01 10:24

Jim Beam straight from the barrel.

SPEAKER_04 10:26

Yeah, that's good stuff, yeah. But that gold bonded, the gym beam uh gold bonded for the price is so good. And I actually really like the double oaked. Uh, the extra age is good, but between the two, double oak's better. I've gone through a lot of that, actually. I usually take that on golf trips.

SPEAKER_01 10:44

So they haven't gotten rid of any of them. Nope. What about the single rumor? Liar. Is the rumor real or is the rumor made up? So most rumors are made up, not made up by them, made up by others of like we can't find it, it's done.

SPEAKER_04 11:00

I like that they're putting an age statement on the black.

SPEAKER_01 11:02

But then you also have rumors with this bottle that we're having, the old overholt 114. What's the rumor with that? It was done. It was only Pennsylvania, Ohio.

SPEAKER_04 11:12

Well, that wasn't a rumor, that was the truth. And then all of a sudden they said it did well. So here you guys go. Yeah, so it's expanding.

SPEAKER_01 11:18

Was the rumor that like it was only this, and then all of a sudden, like, oh, it wasn't only this.

SPEAKER_00 11:22

Now it's more. I mean, if that's true, in that case, the internet's a rumor too.

SPEAKER_01 11:26

Yeah, but have you ever seen Facebook?

SPEAKER_04 11:28

But Nick, we read that. Right. In the store, they had a little flyer thing. Do you remember this? And it said, like, this is a trial thing, and and uh, we're gonna see how it goes.

SPEAKER_01 11:39

So why why trial in Ohio? Why trial in Pennsylvania? Pennsylvania understands.

SPEAKER_04 11:45

I think because Ohio is literally the hardest, most stingy, most retard, like well, I won't say that. They're close, yeah. You feel what I'm saying? They're the stupidest, um, as far as like what they're allowing and what they're not allowing. They they've they're so tight that it's like if it can get through in Ohio, if it does well in Ohio, it can do well anywhere, anywhere. Yep, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 12:08

I really think that that's why they're like, well, if it did well in Ohio, like also the other part of it too is that Ohio is a good place to figure out if your MSRP is right, because you you own that's the only thing if it's sold in the store, it's always that same. They're not gonna buy it, yeah. So, whereas if you go to Indiana or anywhere else, that price isn't always the same. You can go to different stores, you have store competition that may or that's based on based on price, not based on quality. So if you want to decide what how to price your thing, Ohio's a good place for that. Because if every store is the same price, maybe I need to move. Why? I don't like Ohio. Well, I don't either, but in terms of a good place, I mean I shouldn't say that. I actually really like Ohio.

SPEAKER_04 12:52

It's not the end of the world.

SPEAKER_00 12:53

You're two hours away from it for other states. We're literally two hours away from Kentucky, two hours in Kentucky, two hours in Pennsylvania, two hours from India.

SPEAKER_01 13:00

Like how much how uh how much control the state of Ohio seems to not necessarily like boast. They like to boast we are better than you, therefore we can do this.

SPEAKER_04 13:18

Well, I just think it's when you give too much regulation to any and to anybody. I I just feel like there's power and there's power hungry people, and then there's an abuse of power. And I think that Ohio is too regulated, and I think that that's part of it is just greed. Some of it is coming from there was a time where it wasn't regulated at all. I I I mean, I think there's a balance to be had. I don't I don't think it should be unregulated, uh, but I think that it it's over-regulated.

SPEAKER_01 13:44

I would I would love to see a non-regulated state bring in the right. So bring in old overhaul 114 and say for the first year we will sell it at MSRP.

SPEAKER_00 14:00

Then it wouldn't be unregulated because if there's an MSRP, then it's not regulated. Putting stipulations on things, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 14:05

But that's the thing. I would love to see it's not the wild, wild west if you got law and order. I'd you know it.

SPEAKER_01 14:10

That's a whole different conversation.

SPEAKER_04 14:12

Yeah, there's a balance to be had. I think that there's a balance to be had you can't have anarchy, but you also can't have uh 1940 whatever to Germany. 1920 or whatever it was. Uh you you you gotta have a balance between the the two, and uh I think that everything needs balance. But speaking of balance, just to interject, because I haven't had any of this liquor yet.

SPEAKER_01 14:36

You haven't had any of it?

SPEAKER_04 14:37

I haven't sipped any of that, but I just forget how much I like this tobacco because so Hyde Park was one of those things that was on my radar for a long time. I tried a lot of other Dunhill blends. I never got Hyde Park up until like the last well, I think two years ago is when I first dabbled into Hyde Park. And I because I always thought it was an English tobacco, and you because it says that and everything else, when I finally got it and I smoked it, and I was like, this is not your every other English, you know what I mean? Because I was like, why would I go after it? I have nightcap. Like if I want a Dunhill English, I either want early morning pipe or a nightcap, and that's it for me. I why would I go after Hyde Park? And then I smoked it and I was like, this is something. And what's interesting is it now I'm you know smoking this, and it says it's an old English blend. What I think they mean by that is like, because smoking this almost reminds me of like something somebody would smoke in England back in the day, not an English per se type of like with Latiquia and stuff, yeah, but like it's kind of an old world tobacco flavor, fancy old world tobacco, yeah, sophisticated, like walking around the streets of London smoking this on a kind of a drab, kind of a dreary kind of musty, kind of like rainy kind of yeah, and you know, it just is a really nice, different flavor kind of change of pace blend. I like it. Forget how much I like it.

SPEAKER_01 16:00

It brings about that uh Shaw Combs, you know, like you uh so the movie, right? So you see them in like uh at the end talking to a guy you can't really see in the carriage, yeah. They're like rainy kind of feel. That's what this brings about.

SPEAKER_04 16:14

Well, and you know, we're talking about fall, and this is kind of like a wet fall day.

SPEAKER_01 16:18

It really is like a rainy, not necessarily like stormy, it's after the storm.

SPEAKER_04 16:23

Yeah, it's just wet roads and wet leaves, wet leaves, and yeah. What this is hounds of the Baskervilles, and yeah, it's doing it, it's it's holding up its end of the of the how does this go?

SPEAKER_01 16:36

I'm curious how this goes with the the whiskey. I'm gonna try it. Because we're talking higherproof old overhold. So we talked about bonded last time was a step up flavor. It was the uh the paved road, right? Chip and seal to the gravel. What is this past that? That was a bit more on flavor. What does 114 do to that?

SPEAKER_00 16:58

So it continues to get deeper, like it's still like this has even I don't want to say more flavor, but the flavor is a little bit more intense. It's longer lasting, yeah. Longer lasting. Okay, you're starting to get a finish now, whereas the the the bonded didn't have much of a finish. It was there, but it was muted.

SPEAKER_04 17:18

It's lean, it's lingering on your palate and actually in your chest.

SPEAKER_00 17:20

Yeah, yeah. This this goes down the chest.

SPEAKER_04 17:23

Yeah, now we got a higher price at that.

SPEAKER_01 17:25

Yeah, I'm a I'm a manly man rye.

SPEAKER_04 17:28

This will pop hairs on your chest, yeah, without be without being overpowering because it's still kind of subtle. How does this go with the hide park? I mean, I hate to toot my own horn, but I think it's which it's weird because the first time it was kind of like the one was taking place at the other, and then the other one was like the other one was allowing the the the bonded to kind of do its thing. This one has got its own flavors going on, but it's just in my opinion, it's almost like and they're both very full flavored, but they're they're working together, which is weird because you think that they would there's not enough room for both of them in the room, but I think that they're good. It's I'm getting a lot of flavor on the pipe, and I'm getting a lot of fit flavor in the glass, but I don't feel like I they're competing. Yeah, I don't know. Is it overload? Yes. Is it good? Yeah, like it's not overload in a bad way, it's overload in a good way. This is a stout night. This is a stout night. There's a there's a lot going on. Like I said, if you were to eat like a good steak and potatoes, and you had this and this afterward, yeah, this is a follow-up.

SPEAKER_00 18:32

This is a little bit of a backroom deal kind of kind of combo. Like I'm I'm gonna be having my steak, drinking this, smoking this, and making business deals. Yeah, making business deals, maybe playing a high-stakes poker game. Yeah, there you go.

SPEAKER_04 18:44

High stakes poker. Sophisticated high-stakes poker game at a gentleman's club, like like old London gentleman, not like a strip club.

SPEAKER_01 18:51

Yeah, I perceive the the old overholt as kind of the uh vinegar tobacco. Or not a tobacco, sorry, the vinegar uh barbecue. Does that fit with your tobacco then? Kind of vinegary, like uh uh open pit vinegary, like uh like mustard vinegary, like not like like white vinegar, right? So like uh there's some substance to that. But does that play into that like bitey vinegary kind of feel?

SPEAKER_04 19:24

I don't think so. I don't know. Maybe I'm not quite getting what you're saying, but it's more like the um espresso versus the coffee. It's a stronger flavor. That's why I keep saying like this would be good after a steak, because I think that people, this is not for the faint, this pairing is not for the fainter heart. Yeah, you almost might need to get a good meal under your belt. Yeah, this is not for the beginner. This could not knock you for a loop. Uh, and it's actually making this, I think, you know what I think it is. I think the tobacco may be making the the 114 stronger. Yeah, and I think the 114 might be making the tobacco stronger.

SPEAKER_01 20:02

Yeah, stronger in what bolder, bolder, okay, bolder flavored, more full flavors, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 20:06

Yeah, because like I, you know, if you've ever uh Steve, you can you can agree with this. If you ever tried a tobacco that really kind of knocks you for a loop, yeah, uh, and some people will say, like, watch out, like you can get the swims, you know, or but like it's just like I think of like um old dark fired or something like that, where you're you're like, I'm like, I'm smoking on the deepest, darkest, most bold. Like, if James Earl Jones was a pipe tobacco, I'm smoking this, you know what I mean? And Hyde Park is that, but maybe not to that degree. But this paired with this 114 is kind of making it to that degree, so they're almost building each other up. Yeah, they're they're um what's that word? They're uh they're they're bracing each other, they're bracing each other up. So they're yeah, they're kind of like building each other up. Yeah, I think it's a it's a weird pairing because they're both kind of full flavored, but they're kind of working really well, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 21:01

So it fills in the gaps.

SPEAKER_00 21:02

There is no gaps, there is no gaps, no gaps, yeah. This is this is too uh uh have you ever seen uh forget the characters a little bit, but just use the image of uh uh Emperor's New Groove when when they're going back to back and bracing themselves against the wall and climbing up the side, they're kind of like that. They're two strong characters, like two, they're they're both together, right, and they're both rising, so there are no gaps to fill. There's no room for anyone, they're just building up on each other.

SPEAKER_01 21:37

So the two combined is the scotch, full flavored, full bodied, a little bit, yeah. But not we're not competing, we're not beating, we're we are just we're enhancing each other. You guys, so you guys are at this point. I wish I could join. If I can compare it, you guys are at the fire pit in October and you're having a scotch. We are fire on fire, fire. Yes. One is not competing. One is not fighting against, but we are firing.

SPEAKER_04 22:05

You can do too much, right? It's not overpowering. It's not full de bursting. It's not underwhelmed. It's like your glass is just like somebody poured it out and stopped right at the moment where it hits the brim. There's not any room for more. It's perfect. Okay. So I wouldn't want any more or less.

SPEAKER_01 22:24

You guys are not at a fire. You guys are burning leaves and drinking something at the same time.

SPEAKER_00 22:30

Yeah, I don't know. I don't what I get is content. Yeah. Yeah. And I like I'm even trying to figure out the right word because I earlier I said that they were enhancing each other. And that's wrong. Because they're not enhancing that one needs enhancement. And one doesn't need enhanced. You guys are playing together. These are they're Evan Costello. They're they're they're both good on their own right. Oh if both he puts it on, it just slides right in.

SPEAKER_03 22:56

Well, shoot.

SPEAKER_01 22:58

This is the logovalin to burning leaves. What I would consider logovalin to burning leaves, right? So we're in that fall. We're we'll break the leaves, but we're not gonna, we don't care about the environment. We're gonna burn them. We have that smell along with we're drinking smoky scotch. We're drinking the logovalin. We're not drinking barbecue, we're drinking smoke, like nice, easy going along with the burning leaves. That's what you guys are getting.

SPEAKER_00 23:27

I mean they're not fighting, yeah, yeah. They are just mellowing together as they grow. Yep. The only challenge I'm gonna have to that is that I do care about the environment, which is why I'm burning the leaves. Because if you rake them up, that's bad for the environment. Don't rake your leaves. Oh, what? What don't rake your leaves. Oh do you mulch them? Yeah, you mulch them, I mulch them. Just leave them. Just leave them be. I mulch mine. What do you want? Grass is bad for the environment. So grass is no good. Why do you have a monoclonal grass? I'm curious. Your yard is to impress your neighbor, not to save the nature.

SPEAKER_04 24:01

I'm very curious about because I've never been a leaf raker. I'm a leaf mulcher.

SPEAKER_01 24:05

I hate mowing. I hate raking.

SPEAKER_00 24:08

Don't do either one. Why? Why? You are you are you're benefiting your neighbor, not the world. Well, you gotta mow your grass, though. No, you don't. You believe it. Let it grow.

SPEAKER_04 24:18

Steve, Steve, I got something that's gonna change your mind. I got something that's gonna change your mind. Have you ever seen a kid play in tall grass? Have you? I well, I mean I have. Yeah, but you were the kid. I mean, that's different. Wait until you see, wait until you see a kid who just is barely walking, try to play in some tall grass. It ain't gonna happen. Why? It's hard. They're hard, they fall down, they fall down, they twist their ankle, they're not having fun, they can't kick the ball. Yeah, there's gonna be a time where you're like, I need to cut this to where it's carpet out here so they can have fun. Yeah, and you're gonna be like, you know, you know, F what I said, I'm gonna cut this down. But that's not for the environment, then it's for me. It's selfish. I think cutting grass is selfish, but I also think it's selfish like for like other people too, because like I want, I would rather not cut the grass. I mean, I could I could take that time to like do whatever I want, but so it's like double selfish, you know what I mean? But I will say that I it for kids, they need some short grass to plant.

SPEAKER_00 25:15

You shouldn't have a lawn in general because a single blade of grass, like grass is just not it's a weed, like it doesn't, it's whatever. Uh wait, uh I know there's weeds, but no grass is a weed, we've just made it into a pretty weed, but it's just a weed, but you should have clover, you should have dandelion, you should have like those things are good for the world, like that's what you should have. Like, if you're if we're talking about environmental, that's what you should have. I'm fine with clover.

SPEAKER_02 25:43

Did you guys ever have that? We had clover.

SPEAKER_04 25:45

All of our grass was clover. There were a few places I lived where if you looked at it, it was just clover. Yeah, that's all it was, right?

SPEAKER_00 25:52

Well, where's that at? It yeah, it's all gone away for Kentucky bluegrass for no reason. So yeah, that grass is nice on your feet, the clover, and it uses a ton of water, and it's a bad monoculture. It's like there's no room for for bugs and worms and all that kind of stuff. And that's what the that's why the the leaves are so good, too. It's it's a home for the bugs and the worms and everything, and the spiders and all that. Those are good things. I know we've made them bad, but again, I'm talking from an environmental standpoint, not a benefit to you and your home standpoint. Yeah, not a similar thing. Wait, wait, so burning leaves is good for the environment? Uh better than raking them and putting them in a bag. Really? Yeah, for sure. Because then that I mean that's just carbon. You're just adding that to your top shot. That's a good thing.

SPEAKER_04 26:43

And we have uh trucks that come over and suck up the leaves, all you have to do is rake them to the end of your street. I don't even do that, I just mulch them. Laura finds that the most like hillbuildy thing. And I'm like, no, like this is what we did growing up.

SPEAKER_00 26:56

Yeah, like no, feeds no reason to rake your leaves. I am anti-rake leaves, it's bad for everything. Don't do it. You've heard it here first, guys. Heard it here, folks. So where's my lawn mowing too? That's my lawn card.

SPEAKER_04 27:10

We didn't have we didn't have uh we didn't have like uh sprinkler systems, yeah. No, we didn't treat our grass and we didn't rake leaves. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 27:18

I'm pretty sure that uh irony moment here. I'm pretty sure there's a photo on our podcast page of me burning leaves and setting a bottle of scotch with a glass beside it.

SPEAKER_04 27:31

And I finished up that you know burning leaves can be aromatic.

SPEAKER_01 27:35

Oh, it's it's it's amazing. But again, but I've been told it's really a selfish thing.

SPEAKER_04 27:40

Maybe you want to burn leaves, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 27:42

That'd be a selfish thing, but it's not bad for the environment. Yeah, it's good.

SPEAKER_04 27:46

You can burn leaves. I mean, on the ozone leaves, I don't care a whole lot about the environment. I I do things based on like if I want to do them or not. Yeah, so so well.

SPEAKER_00 27:54

This is a win-win. You don't have to spend the time working leaves anymore.

SPEAKER_01 27:58

But okay, what about the ozone layer, right? We have to burn fire, we release things into the ozone layer kind of crap.

SPEAKER_00 28:06

So you're not releasing it's uh the leaves are already dead, so you're not like killing an oxygen maker. So what about fireworks?

SPEAKER_04 28:16

I I listen, I believe the Bible is inerrant. Is it what is inerrant. I believe the Bible is gonna have no errors in it. Oh, okay, okay. And in the Bible it says Jesus does come back. Okay. The world's gotta last that long, at least. So the ozone layer is not my concern.

SPEAKER_03 28:34

Got it. You know what I'm saying? So we're already set, like it's gonna last as long as it needs to last. The ozone layer can be can can can be.

SPEAKER_01 28:42

But if we're talking C terms of dead, what about firewood?

SPEAKER_00 28:46

Is that the same thing? It's a fire, the the wood is dead, right? So now we're getting into we're getting into some philosophy now because it's it you open that door, you have to keep yourself warm. So, what's the best way to keep yourself warm? Is it well, is it burning wood, or is it burning coal, or is it burning uh electricity, or is it like you have to keep yourself warm to stay alive? So, which one is better?

SPEAKER_01 29:13

Sorry, so the reason I ask this is because someone has said wood or leaves is killing the ozone layer.

SPEAKER_00 29:21

Is it uh I don't really know to be honest, but I can tell you that I can tell you that if you're trying to keep yourself warm, burning wood would be a better option environmentally than burning coal or using a bunch of electricity, which basically is coal. So environmentally, it's it's it's may not be perfect because we are humans and humans are affecting the ozone, but we're affecting all everything that but if that's if that's your argument, that means you're pro eliminating humans, right? And that's not environmental.

SPEAKER_04 29:57

That that's not there's a survival instinct there that every creature has, and that's not even that you have to like there that is a very low-level thing that's for the ozone is burning firewood.

SPEAKER_00 30:08

It's for the vegetarians out there.

SPEAKER_04 30:10

Well, we were we well, but we were never meant to me to eat meat, right? Well, I say to those people if we did not eat the meat, they would be overpopulated. That's a serious problem. Why would God create a world where there's these animals that become overpopulated if we were not meant to eat those things? Clearly, we we were meant to eat those things, like like it just they wouldn't be a thing. Right. And most vegetarians might say, well, God didn't create those animals at all.

SPEAKER_00 30:37

The environmental version, if you don't want to be religious, then it's the canines on your teeth are proof of like, yeah, we're we're we're obviously in our in our gut biomes being made to be able to take down meat. So like, yeah, we we obviously can do that and should do that. But well, should is up to you, I guess. If you don't want to eat it, don't, but just don't yell at me. Yeah, uh, but uh uh yeah, really more the vegans are the problem. I'm cool with vegetarians. Vegans and leaf rakers, right? How dare we?

SPEAKER_03 31:11

We're gonna make a t-shirt. Vegans and leaf rakers, leaf rakers and uh uh air quotes offensive, offensive, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 31:19

And in a bad way, yeah, not in a bad way, not in a bad way.

SPEAKER_01 31:23

Might be the first time I don't know how we got to this. I'm not sure either. I mean, good luck editing. I we could scale back and figure it out, but I don't I don't care too much. We're gonna jump back. Uh but anyway, for this particular one. So, what do you have on this guy? Any any history? Any reason why we did this? I mean, other than it's Pennsylvania, yeah. Well, when did it come out? Uh 203? No, 20. No, we're much later than that. What 2022?

SPEAKER_00 31:53

Uh I think it was 23.

SPEAKER_01 31:55

Oh, I was close up. Uh okay. So two years. I think it's 2022. I could be wrong.

SPEAKER_04 32:03

It could be 22, yeah. But either way, I thought this was like five years ago.

SPEAKER_01 32:07

Not 2020.

SPEAKER_04 32:10

Not during COVID. Well, maybe before COVID.

SPEAKER_00 32:14

I didn't think it was long after we moved into this house.

SPEAKER_01 32:16

No, which was 2017.

SPEAKER_00 32:18

So I can tell you it's for sure after 2017.

SPEAKER_01 32:21

Oh, thankfully. So I can say at least that. Okay, all right.

SPEAKER_04 32:24

Sometime between 2017 and the year 2023.

SPEAKER_01 32:28

So it's yeah, it would have been after I left the bar. So 2020. I don't think we found this at work in the bogey. I think it was after. I could be wrong. Well, it's neither here nor there, I guess.

SPEAKER_04 32:42

But basically, this came out this came out somewhere around 2017.

SPEAKER_01 32:46

So why Pennsylvania, why Ohio? Do you know? Do they give a reason why just those? I mean, the Pennsylvania makes sense, but it was a test subject. So that's all it was. It makes sense if the mash bill matched the idea of Pennsylvania rye.

SPEAKER_00 33:04

No, it this is a rye, and it's out of Pennsylvania.

SPEAKER_01 33:08

But or it's it's the it's a Pennsylvania company. So but there's Pennsylvania rye, the Pennsylvania style bill.

SPEAKER_00 33:14

Yeah, yeah, there is, but this is marketing. This is just rye.

SPEAKER_01 33:18

So it's it's not like hey, we're Pennsylvania.

SPEAKER_00 33:20

This is a rye, and they were in the process of making their Pennsylvania location.

SPEAKER_04 33:27

Uh it even it says right there, like in big letters, made in Kentucky. Yes, it is made in Kentucky. But for Pennsylvania, right, and or Ohio, and or if it's not.

SPEAKER_01 33:37

That's what drives me insane, is like there's Pennsylvania style rye, which is very specific to Pennsylvania. And then there's this is just rye.

SPEAKER_04 33:47

But there's Maine, there's Maine lobster that's not that's not made in Maine, you know what I mean?

SPEAKER_01 33:52

No, but they match that style, yeah. But you get what I'm saying? Like I so I get what you're saying. It's not made in Maine, but it matches the style. This does not match the style of Pennsylvania rye.

unknown 34:03

Oh, I see.

SPEAKER_01 34:04

But it's for Pennsylvania. That's the first one. That's what I'm trying to figure out. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 34:10

You ever heard that term? What's that? Ohio's for lovers. Ohio's for lovers, yeah. It was our state motto there for a little while.

SPEAKER_02 34:16

Uh song about that.

SPEAKER_00 34:18

Uh, so going back to our history a little bit, and then we're gonna hop back to this. Oh, okay. So uh we ended with with prohibition.

SPEAKER_04 34:25

I was gonna say, like, there's a big gap between if they didn't do anything, there's a big gap between bonded and this 2017.

SPEAKER_00 34:32

We are far into this thing for history, but yes, but there's a pretty big gap though, in terms of like interesting history involved in these things. We brought 1920s, so that's prohibition hits in the 1920s, ends in 1930. Okay, and nothing new has come out since bottled and bond before prohibition. Because I'm sure there's been company changes. I'm sure there, yes, there were changes to the lineup, everyone's a national brand, they did all that stuff. Um, but like from the 30s up into the 70s, nothing exciting happened in whiskey. But that is kind of a testament that they stayed. Yeah, everything's just stayed the same for like kept getting bought, like they stayed in business the Canadian club, but like for any brand, yeah, like nothing happened in the whiskey world from 1930 to 1970, not even whiskey. Why? Uh, because why? Because nobody cared, but why do we care now? Why do we don't care now?

SPEAKER_01 35:27

That's why we're skipping 50 years. I'm saying, like, why did we have a change? Why why did we want something more because then people started fearing?

SPEAKER_04 35:36

Forget whiskey for any brand to do that well for that amount of time is quite amazing. I mean, Blockbuster couldn't even cut it like 20 years, you know what I mean.

SPEAKER_01 35:46

Why do brands care that much to say we have to market, we have to change, we have to adapt.

SPEAKER_00 35:54

Well, because they want to stay alive.

SPEAKER_01 35:55

Well, but but no, no, I get that, but why do we care about them changing along the way?

SPEAKER_04 36:03

Standing the test of time. Uh what I'm saying is whether or not not changing, the fact that they were able to keep their head afloat in in 50 years, like uh there's toothpaste brands that didn't make it. You know what I mean? Like Colgate's one of the big brands because they stood the test of time.

SPEAKER_01 36:18

So sorry, my question so we don't care, right? About what? The the change. We do care about changes, but that's why we're gonna talk about all the changes.

SPEAKER_04 36:29

Yeah, the fact that they changed and they were able to not, they didn't go under.

SPEAKER_01 36:32

So if we we jump back to, I'm gonna jump back jump back to the leaves. We burn leaves because we like the smell of the aromatics. We uh leaves don't change, they die, we burn them, they grow, but they come back every year because they're leaves, but they're the same, right? Right. So they're gonna come back, they can count on leaves, so they're the same smell each year. Why do we care about products changing, but not the smell of the leaves?

SPEAKER_00 36:59

So why no? Here's here's where your problem is. Okay, we did this, we burned the leaves for 50 years, yeah, right, and because we like it, that's the same thing, nothing changed for 50 years. Yeah, the fact that we never got a lot of things. We still burn the why why do we care about the products? Because we changed, we are wait, um just a second. Are we are you concerned about the 50 years of no change, or are you concerned about the next year that it did change?

SPEAKER_01 37:26

Yes, okay, the change. Well, why do we change? Why why do we care about the change if we still burn the same leaves now? We all like the smell, we all like the same thing. But that's the thing.

SPEAKER_00 37:37

The the difference is we're not the same person from 50 years ago, right? Especially with the new millennium, yeah. That's the thing. We're you're no longer the same person, like there's you're you're another generation, you're another group of people. There's cars now. There wasn't cars then. Like this was the 20th century, it's a different world. That's the reason. We're the 21st century.

SPEAKER_01 37:57

Always burn the same leaves. We're the different generation, but each generation has burned the same leaves.

SPEAKER_04 38:04

But would you not appreciate it if the leaves came out a different color than they've ever been?

SPEAKER_00 38:08

I I mean, do they change the channel? But I burn leaves every year, yeah, because during this season I like the smell of leaves, but I don't get them three months from now, but they're the same smell each year, right?

SPEAKER_01 38:25

And I don't have it for 11 months out of the year, but for this month I do. They always got the same smell, they always got the same. The leaves never changed. Right. Why do we care if the products change? If the leaves that have always stayed the same are the same, the products now jump three, four generations above that. We care what they smell like, what they taste like, what they market as. But leaves, we're not gonna rake them no matter what. Yeah, but we can't change them. It's it's leaves, it's it's also true. But in your in your metaphor here, it's there is no metaphor. It is the leaf. Not a four leaf.

SPEAKER_03 39:05

Listen, it's leaf change leaves. Right. But here's the difference. Why do you want to change?

SPEAKER_04 39:11

Hold on, let me talk. If you're can if you compare leaves to old overhold, the cool thing about old overhold is you have the old leaves and you have new leaves, and you can choose whether you have the old or the new.

SPEAKER_03 39:22

The problem with leaves is we don't have a new leaf, we only have the old leaves. Why are we content with that? Because we don't have new ones, there's no other option. There's either leaves or no leaves.

SPEAKER_00 39:32

There's no other options not content with it because we have a liquor store of a thousand other brands of a thousand other kinds of leaves. Right, right.

SPEAKER_03 39:39

There's too many leaves coming out to keep up with it. Yeah, the leaves are not a metaphor. The leaves are a constant, like you can't change leaves. Yeah, yeah, exactly. And so is old overhold bonded. So it's always the same. Why do we care if it's we appreciate that?

SPEAKER_04 39:54

Because it's a new iteration. If all of a sudden there was blue leaves, I'd be like, that's pretty damn cool. Yeah, why?

SPEAKER_01 39:59

I still like the old leaves, but those blue leaves are pretty damn cool. So are the blue different from the the normal? I mean, they look different. If you care, why what what why does that impact you? So if the blue are different from the normal, why do you care? Does that impact you for flavor, for smell, for raking, for burning?

SPEAKER_04 40:18

Listen, you're talking to a guy who has 300 and some odd pocket knives. And if you ask anybody, that's probably like 290. Uh uh, there's it's it's definitely like three almost 300 more knives than I need.

SPEAKER_01 40:30

Small amount, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 40:31

Okay. Like I probably need like 20 at the most. No, and that's the thing. I mean, it's to a degree, and Laura's asked me that. I'm like different blade steels and different grind angles and different shapes. They look cool. At the end of the day, they cut this, they all cut, they're all cutting tools. Right. They open differently, they lock differently, they look different, they handle different, they feel different. There's a lot of variations, but if based on your metaphor, I should just be happy with one knife, but I am not all right, because I can get more knife.

SPEAKER_00 41:02

We're not getting this, so real quick, Nick. Why do we burn the same leaves every year?

SPEAKER_01 41:08

So you talk about is there a metaphor? There's a reason behind this. Yeah, we're on the third bottle of old over old. Yeah, why are we talking about this? Well, it's a different bottle, it's a completely different bottle. But why? Why is it complete? It's the same leaf. No, it's not the same leaf. It came, it dropped from the same tree. Well, sure. But why is it different?

SPEAKER_00 41:33

I've got two kids, or you've got two kids. They're they dropped from the same tree, too.

SPEAKER_03 41:37

That's I was just about to go with that.

SPEAKER_04 41:39

Like, every kid is different, and then every generation of family is different.

SPEAKER_01 41:42

So hold on, we talk about we we we've talked about the third, we're going on this whole series of old overhaul, right? We dropped from old overhaul 80 to bonded. There's a complete difference between the two. 114 to bonded, not uh proof-wise, not that much flavor. Okay, but why do we why should people care so much about the fact that old overhaul said we could have a third? Well, what's the thing?

SPEAKER_04 42:13

I'll tell you why I think, and that's what I was trying to hit on before we started talking about leaves. Is here and here, let me hear I'm gonna say it. What's amazing is for 50 years or whatever, they were fine with not changing and they were doing what they were successful. And then at some point, whether they needed to or not, they decided time to make a change. Let's try something else without getting rid of what's been working for 50 years. Let's add to, not take away, from ourselves and see if people like it. And matter of fact, it's such a big change for us. We're gonna make it, you know, air quotes, experimental. Let's do Pennsylvania and do Ohio. And guess what? If it doesn't work, we're getting out because what has been working for 50 years is this. And we don't want to get away from that. But we're okay with trying something new. We're okay with challenging ourselves. We're okay with being 70 years old and saying, maybe I can do something else. Maybe I do have 20 more years of my life. You know what I mean? I you have to respect that A, something's worked for somebody for that amount of time, and B, they're willing, even at that age, to change. That's quite commendable. You know what I mean? You look at a guy that's like looking at the end of his life, and he has what some people would consider a not even a mid, but like an end-life crisis and does something new. I look at that like you might fail, but you are willing to try it. That's commendable. That's exciting, and that's what I think is what you're trying to get at. Why should people care? Because that's pretty effing cool.

SPEAKER_01 43:44

Well, so I I get the care. You and I have had a lot of experience for whiskey. Steve has had a lot of experience within the podcast club. You and I have had more. That's a different subject. You and I have a different, we have a deeper appreciation, right? I feel like you and I feel fail to understand and hopefully I'm hoping that you can bring us along this journey, right? Steve, why I'm new in the journey for whiskey. I'm new into rye. Why should I jump in price or or even deviate from 80 proof, let alone 100 proof to 114 for the exact same thing? It's rye.

SPEAKER_00 44:22

I have an unsatisfying answer for you. Okay. You shouldn't. If you're new about a Rye, why are you buying a hundred and not for those people proof right? You don't do that. This is not for those that's the thing that like this isn't made for newbies. This is made for this is a newbie bottle. So like this is made for the old old connoisseur. There is a very big like whiskey is a journey. Right. And so there is no ending and there is barely a beginning. Like the beginning is the 80 proof. It's pretty quick to 100 proof. Anything over 100 you should wait a year or or so whatever you're at or however much time it's going to how much depends on how much you drink and and how much you're going to talk about it. Because if you are if you are on a whiskey journey by yourself, then it's going to take you a lot longer and really probably don't spend the money on it because you're not going to have the conversations and stuff that are going to like really make the value out of those really expensive bottles. Because most of the value in whiskey comes from the camaraderie not the liquid inside of it. So like unless you're like a history buff or something you want to grab something cool because of that and you get to read the story on it or whatever but that's your that's still community that's community around that. So like if you are listening to this podcast you're probably not brand new into whiskey. You're probably like have been around it for a little bit long enough to care about our opinions on it. So like you're not brand new. So like something like this bottle isn't made for a beginner it's made for somebody that's been doing this for a little bit or is around people that is do has been doing it for a little bit.

SPEAKER_04 46:08

To add on that I would say there's an appreciation level to to to to bourbon obviously or whiskey or whatever you want to call it. And I I feel like there's two people that would get into old overhold for 114 specifically it would be people who are already in like they've been built up into Rise and they see it. Oh I've heard of old overhold and they want to try it and they like it. Those people would probably never go backwards because if they appreciate old overhold 14 and that's the first thing they've tried from old overhalt why would you go backwards? You wouldn't the other people are the ones that have been into old overhold and have gotten to the point where they like like like you said Steve where they've progressed into 114 and they appreciate it and they're finally to that point. This is great. But those people like me would still appreciate the bottle in bond and the 80 proof and they probably would keep it in their collection because why? They appreciate what it is. That doesn't mean they're going to drink it all the time but they appreciate what it is. I wouldn't I I would never get rid of these bottles and if if I do get rid of them at this point I mean if you were to say which out of the three is the best it's 114. So from a purely a purchaser standpoint why would I even own the other two? I wouldn't however I appreciate it like my knives like my thing with my knives I appreciate it for what it is. Am I taking a step back? Yeah have I done that with my knives have I bought knives that were older that are actually not as good as the newer stuff the steel's not as good the lock mechanism is not as good whatever it is not as good but I appreciate them for what it was at the time it came out appreciate it for what it is now. I appreciate it's history appreciate that maybe it's not going to be around forever am I going to go back and buy the 80 proof and the and the bottled and bond in and have them even though I can get 114 which is better. Yeah because I appreciate it for what it is. So you have those two people now there's people that would try the 114 and I'm in a rise I like that this is great. They're never going to go to if they tried 80 they'd be like this sucks. Yeah right they're not going to appreciate it. Whatever. So there's there's multiple levels of this right so I mean I think that that's that's part of it. I mean but I don't think old overhold by putting this out was saying we suck we need to we need to reinvent ourselves I think it was their way of like having like a midlife not maybe not a midlife crisis they wanted to expand. So they wanted to grow yeah so they wanted to grow are we at the top the top of the mountain of old overhold apparently not because there's a 10 year coming so not to say that everything is downhill but is is it are we achieving the best in our mind right here we've had we we are we are improving for what we've had of these three are we at the best of the three this is the best of the three yeah there is no top this is the best of the three and there is no top because something else could come out down the road. So when you're hiking the sky's the limit nick do you guys when you're hiking do you guys ever get to the tip top what what is that but the the tip top in elevation but that's not the best of the experience there we go so do you get the best of the experience before you get to the top sometimes sometimes before sometimes after sometimes at the top okay so just a bit there's a possibility we're at the tip top for what we know for what we've had this is the best yeah this is the best of the three yeah but let me ask you this have you ever been on a hike or a climb or whatever where you've reached a certain point probably the best part of that experience and you've said this is so good I'm done I'm never hiking again. No most of the time you're like I can't wait for my next one now I want to go to this one. You just experienced the best part of the probably the best hike you've ever had and you're already thinking about your next one. Okay does that diminish that no it doesn't diminish it.

SPEAKER_01 49:54

It just it it makes you want more this is the best of what you've experienced but you want more than actually you always will because we're human beings and we're greedy selfish people.

SPEAKER_00 50:03

Fair fair but for those that are saying I'm new to the whiskey I want AD proof this this idea that this is the best you'll ever get how can I work up to that is that fair to say this is the best you'll get that we know of of what we've tried when we're talking about whiskey everything is subjective so there is no when I say this is the best we've ever had yeah that's what I'm saying. Okay. It's a different experience for you. A lot of times it's the best you've ever had so far and also if we're going back to hiking if if I'm a new hiker I'm not going to climb a 10,000 foot mountain which is what this 114 is yeah you're not going good call Steve I heard about climbing and I'm never gonna hike again.

SPEAKER_03 50:57

Imagine you're you're halfway up Everest first time you got frostbite first time.

SPEAKER_00 51:03

Yeah right yeah so then you know that this is the wrong mountain for you. This is the long wrong climb.

SPEAKER_01 51:11

But okay so we're not looking to freak people out by this right this is not the frostbite for Everest. This is the week of work up to this that's why they kept the other in their lineup.

SPEAKER_00 51:22

They didn't like get rid of the other ones you know what I mean yeah they they knew that this was not going to be their everyday you know basic optim now to reverse this metaphor a little bit and and talk about what what Chris said when he said like if you're already a whiskey person and you have the 114 you never have the 80 or the 100 and you're not going to go backwards I did a hike in in uh uh the teetons or the yeah the the the the TTs and uh and but I did it in reverse I started at the we we were like you know what we're gonna go for this hike and we're gonna end at this restaurant for like uh like a like a lunch or whatever was that twin peaks did you move I can you see him like walking back we're thinking so but we started we started at the overlook we started at the overlook the overlook hotel no like at the at the overlook of the mountain I thought you were talking about uh we started at the top the shiny no the twin peaks yeah so we started at the top so we get these beautiful views where we drive up there we get these amazing views it's this beautiful mountain and then we hike down the mountain why would you drive up to to eat to eat uh at at this restaurant and then we have to walk back so that means that uh your your best it was was at the very beginning and now that that meal and like the second time we had to hike up the hill which freaking sucked because I already know what's up there I've already been there. So I'm doing all this hard work because like if you're doing a good hike you kind of hate it until you get to the top until you get to whatever this view is or this thing is that you're trying to get to so for us making the thing we're trying to get to this restaurant that's kind of down the mountain was a horrible idea because now the whole hike back is all uphill it's this it's this massive hike and I just ate and there's no payoff at the end. I've already seen the top and that's what it would be like going backwards to the hundred or the 80.

SPEAKER_04 53:23

For a lot of people for if if you're already a whiskey guy that starts with the 114 unless you really really love it and you want to get you want to squeeze everything you can out of an experience. And I think that's how we are kind of with certain things. If you really really love a thing you're gonna do if you're gonna take every avenue you can to experience all of it. Right? I think about video games you ever had a video game where you've just played it and played it and played it you've played it front and back and inside and out and you've gone through every option and every okay another example I love I'm a big reader I love choose your own adventure novels when I did it I was a kid I've worst those are the worst I love them so much that I would read them with a notebook and every choice every choice no but I love people in house every choice I made I would write it down and I would spend forever till when I did not get down with a book until I had gone through every avenue every choice do you know how many choices you can get through if you change them up I mean it's like you can read it like 52 different ways.

SPEAKER_01 54:25

I feel like this is why you love video games and I cannot do them.

SPEAKER_04 54:28

But it takes a lot to not be and the thing is most people would get bored or tired of that story way before they got through every choice not me. Yeah because I ate it up I wanted to go through every bit of it that I could and I feel like that kind of person like like me I would appreciate if I had to go backwards or whatever. But a lot of people aren't like that. So I think if you don't start with your progression and you don't appreciate you'd either start with this and then you would never go back or you know or you'd start up with that and then you'd never go back. But very few people are going to appreciate their lower offerings but some people would never ever go to 114 like like you said Steve they might go like 80 and the bottle and bond and be like well this is good this is a good stopping point like and I'm gonna have this now and then and do other things but there's people out there that can't that would not like even with years of drinking would not appreciate 114 like it's a rye it's a bit spicy for people. So I don't think Blake would like 114.

SPEAKER_01 55:30

I mean he might appreciate it but I don't think I think between the two he would say the bottle and bond is better you know so why would you know but for us the 114's better so it's it's subjective I mean it's so subjective I feel like so this is why I feel like I say this is the top of the mountain because we could we could teeter totter for both ways neither's bad both are good there's more than one way to skin a cat yes there there's a way that we have the the Blake that's the when we first met Blake it was the weeded Sazerac bourbon now he likes rice he's he he is he's branched right out he's branched into rice so this would be the the top of the mountain we have the other guys coming back right so on the other side of the mountain of like I've got 10 year to 114 I can appreciate everything below that I feel like this is the top of the mountain of uh I could go either way depending on where I came from depending on where I started this might be a good middle of the road I'll get there not gonna say it's the best experience going this way or that way right uh up the mountain or down the mountain but this is my my middle of the road this is the tip top we're apart right this is where I could this is where I could be this is where I could end up what's the cost on this bottle it's not expensive.

SPEAKER_00 56:59

It's not expensive at all I want to say it's it's 50 or under yeah yeah so this guy oh I like to say oh jell q because they like their msrp but I mean here's what you're getting before we even talk about that like yeah the reason I'm asking that is is because I I I guess I really have a problem with the idea of top of the mountain.

SPEAKER_04 57:22

Yeah I I am too because there is no top of the mountain like we're talking about three bottles this is a shitty mountain yeah like the the world is your mountain right like there's so much what I see here and what I see with this series we're doing and maybe I'm different may you know tell me if I'm wrong but what I see with this series is I am an old overhaul guy like I'm a fan of old overhaul and I like the 80 and I appreciate it for what it is when we did it that's what I was talking about. I like the bottle and bond and I appreciate that for what it is. And I and I don't think that bottle and bond makes the 80 any different I appreciate it for what it is. There are two different bottles part of a collection that I enjoy. This one adds to that same thing. I would put them all on a shelf and be like I like every one of these different and for different times I might grab a different one but I appreciate them all and I really like them. I'm not going to choose one over the other and throw the others in the trash I appreciate them for what it is. But what I'm saying is this one specific and I I think we talked about what are you getting out of the 80? There's some great things right what are you getting out of the bottom of the bottom there's some great things. What are you getting out of this one? There's some really great things uh if you were to force me is this the best in my opinion is this the best out of the three yeah because you're spending more money but you're getting a four year straight ride at 114 that's great for the price that's fantastic uh if without this one between the bottle and bond and the 80 which one's better the bottle and bond. Why? Because for a little bit more getting more proof and a four year versus a three year but that being said an 80 for at the time it was like 12 bucks. I mean now it's like 20 but that's a great deal too like I appreciate all of them for what they are and there might be times that I would I don't think I would always grab the 114. There's a reason why I have all three and there's times that I want an 80 proof old overhaul and I like it for what it is. There's times I want the bottleneck and there's times I want the 114. So I have a hard time saying that there's this is the tip top and it because if anytime you say this is the tip top you're done with the other ones. Right.

SPEAKER_00 59:26

Right and we also have two more old overhauls. Right.

SPEAKER_04 59:28

So like if this is mountain I I I don't think you've ever even heard me say this is the best pipe tobacco in the world period. I'd have never I've never even said that about you know frog morton because that makes all the other ones kind of like null and void.

SPEAKER_00 59:42

Why try a new one?

SPEAKER_04 59:44

Why even have a different one right I think different depending on the occasion or what I'm having or what I'm doing there's different pipe tobacco or there's different bottles for the occasion. Now if there's one I don't like because there's things I don't like that I don't have them. Yeah and I don't have them in my collection I don't like them. But and there's things that I don't like uh there's pipe tobacco that I would not buy again there's things that I've appreciated but don't buy they don't they're not for me I'm not gonna buy them bottles that I don't like that they're not they're not gonna stay on the shelf but I will tell you one thing if I finish an an 80 old overhaul I'm buying another one if I finish in a bottle and bond I'm buying another one and if I finish one of these I'm buying another one I want all three I want the option because I appreciate them all. Yeah so I mean there's a rating scale in my opinion for these but that doesn't make the other ones less important or null and void.

SPEAKER_01 1:00:31

So you don't see them as uh stepping stones.

SPEAKER_04 1:00:34

No I I really don't I mean I you could you could see them as a stepping stone if you're progressing through a journey of bourbon uh or we're talking rye whiskey so like well bourbon whiskey whatever whatever it is spirits libations whatever you want to call I I call everything bourbon that these are ryes yeah they're not bourbons but scotch bourbons I call so I really do sometimes I do I yeah it's uh whiskey whatever you want to call it yeah I mean I do think there is a progression here but I think that there's a lot of people that don't start with that progress there's probably a ton of people out there that have started with the bottle and bond there might be a ton of people that started with this yeah there's people I can think of that might get a little bit too hung up with the stats of something and and then they lose the appreciation for what it is. And then if you were to present them with the 80 proof versus like an 11 year old over old old overhold they might really shit on the 80 proof and I think that the dismissing something like that something that has stood the test of time no less since 1810 is really embarrassing. Because if if you were just to dismiss something like that based on stats alone for something that just came out a few years ago versus something that stood the test of time since 1800s. Like come on like I I don't want to it's obviously good on something yeah and that's what I was trying to get at like I mean it's amazing that they really kind of they they went from this to bonded and they hung out for 50 years or whatever before they're like you know maybe we should maybe we should try something you know or what or whatever. But and they they still like you're like but we still put out a good product we're keeping this you know what I mean so something to be said I I have a hard time when you start saying this is the top the tip top of the mountain why have the others yeah right 20 bucks right now is what it is. It used to be 24 I'm pretty sure wow no the 114 is the same price as the 80 I was just about to say that's a that's a hard sell but what's cool too is you can have both you know but I will say that that is a hard sell because this is it should be cheaper.

SPEAKER_00 1:02:40

Yeah again I'm not saying that's not worth it but it's like I thought this is the wrong price. 80 is too expensive and 114 is too cheap. Yes.

SPEAKER_04 1:02:51

Are you sure this is 20 that's what Ojo Goose has yeah they may have it on like uh last call I think I will tell anybody that's listening this bottle for 20 is an absolute effing deal. Yeah it is like you should go out and buy a case I need to go out and buy a case for $20. That's pretty dang impressive next time you see it for $20 let me know.

SPEAKER_02 1:03:12

Pick it up yeah other places are selling it for $35 OJ is selling it for 20 I could say I think it's last call for Ojo Quix 20 28 35 yep if you're in Ohio you have to buy that yeah well it is for 20 bucks I mean that is a no-brainer all right but we'll get into the history in the next episode I think we've spent enough time with this old overhaul dead yet I don't know but there's more to come there's more to come and we're not at the top of the mountain are we sure we'll see all right all right gentlemen next time next time thank you for listening to the podcast if you want more great content and other perks be sure to support the show by clicking the link in the show notes.

SPEAKER_00 1:04:01

We can be reached on our website whiskeytasterspumba.com with any ideas for the show. Thanks again